Is this why theists and theologians (especially xian ones) think that atheists need to 'make their case'?It has been apparent for some time to me that theists don't think that atheism is merely a rejection of theism. Example would be the response to a common atheist response, "Not collecting stamps is not a hobby"; they are not satisfied with this answer.
I think the theist POV on this would be something like "Not smoking is a habit in and of itself". To which I agree, but only with caveats. 1) It really only applies to those who have acquired the habit of smoking in the past or perhaps 2) those who have been heavily exposed to it so as to consciously reject it.
So let's break this down. A theist would never admit that their religion is akin to smoking, but as per their assumption that atheism (not theism) needs to be justified as a system of belief this is the best metaphor we have (you could use drug addiction or alcoholism as a social default in place of smoking as well). Drop the assumption that atheism needs a justification as a system of belief and the addiction metaphor will also be dropped.
A few more questions to theists:
1. Theists, have you the courage to drop the assertion that atheism is more than a negation to your worldviews or have you the courage to *own* this metaphor? You cannot have both.
2. If you own the metaphor, yet twist it around to suit your needs, what does this say about you? I can hear some of you say "Religion is a good habit for people, not a bad one, so it isn't exactly the same". This is called "arguing in good faith" and is more fallacious than arguing in bad faith. Mostly due to the fact that faith is not an inherently good or bad thing. It is obvious that this is a question of 'importance' to you, and because it is, you think it is important or important in exactly the same way to atheists, when it may not be important at all.
3. Don't you find it ironic that many of you who jump on the 'Quit Smoking' campaign wagon also jump on the 'Don't Quit Religion' wagon? If you are a xian whose entire religion is based around one of scapegoating of a deity, how can you not be a scapegoat yourself to stop the 'smoking problem'? I guarantee if you set up an hot-line where you let smokers trash you with insults whenever they had a niccy fit you would see a lot less smokers out there. Show your christ-like example already will ya?
A few questions for other atheists:
1. Are you an ex-theist, and if so, can you relate to this point that atheism can be a 'habit'? Same question to atheists who are heavily exposed to religion. If so, how do you deal with this? Does it reduce to the question of whether religion or cessation of religion is a good or a bad habit? Or can you show a 'smoker' (aka christian) why your POV is a good habit? Does it bother you that there are so many institutionalized 'rationalizations' and 'built-in' stalemates to questions most of us on both sides believe are perfectly decidable?
2. If you are a life-long atheist or grew up in an atheistic environment, I realize you probably would reject the 'not-smoking as habit' metaphor, but what are your views on this as well? Perhaps it bothers you all the more that theists try a 'reach-around' to expose your children to say, creationism or prayer in public schools? How do you inoculate your children to this, as this exposure is highly likely? Also, are you less likely than say, ex-atheists to have a vendetta against the encroachment of religion in other areas? An example might be an election based on the religious views of a politician (I have noticed that religious people tend to vote for those with similar religious views, because they are too lazy to get to know them and they view the religion thing as a shortcut)
Remus and Uncle, Fireball is in love with me which is why I am just about the only atheist here who can make her modify her answer to anything but "TIRH, blah blah blah..."
Fireball
we dont care about theory cases...wrong wrong
it is true that your belief is rejection of GOD...dont waste time with ranting too long
skepsis
fireball can't even give a straight answer....
EddieJ
I'm not sure if you carried your analogy far enough. Theists see atheism not simply as not smoking, but working to get smoking prohibited in public places.
Atheism, by itself, doesn't do that. But there are certainly activist atheists here. But theists are not simply against the activists when theists threaten atheists with hell.
Dilbert
I'm Dilbert.
Shub Niggurath
First off, as I understand it, as a theist, my look on the world is that certain energies exist that we cannot comprehend and as such, we attribute them to a higher power.
Atheists however, believe that there is no God, rather than the belief that such a thing is impossible. After all, if most atheists follow science, they would understand that what cannot be proved due to lack of evidence, also fails to be disproven for the same reason.
As such, atheism is simply a belief that there is nothing 'more' to the things we do in life. You are what you are and you do what you do. Science generally dictates what we do/don't understand.
More importantly, I do not feel that 'anyone' theist or atheist, should feel the need to justify their beliefs or 'make their case' as you put it. Whatever a person tends to believe is their own choice, not those of fickle whims who believe everyone should see things their way.
Orignal From: Is this why theists and theologians (especially xian ones) think that atheists need to 'make their case'?
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